Category: SL User Group Meetings

Have a Parametric New Year!

Posted on by Inara Pey

The New Year brings with it news that the mesh parametric deformer project has reached an Alpha code release.

The news broke via a Metareality podscast, and follows-on from the previous weeks’ podcast in which Karl Stiefvatar (Qarl Fizz in SL, formerly Qarl Linden) was about to make an Alpha push of the code.

In discussing the release, Karl states, “I should specific immediately that it’s not done; but the heavy lifting part of it is – the tricky 3D math, the place to integrate into the render pipeline,etc, etc, is … So I’ve giving it to you now in this form so that you can give me feedback, because there are decisions that need to be made now that we should make together.”

You can read the background to the project via my conversation with Max Graf.

Karl has released a video demonstrating progress to date, which is available on his website and YouTube:

The video itself is both informative and impressive; demonstrating the deformer working on a standard avatar and on “mesh avatars” human & non-human  (so using it, you can now increase the body fat of a mesh avatar if you so wish). Additionally, the deformer works with the Linden-Lab implemented avatar physics as well – again including non-human avatar meshes.

The code does have a couple of additional caveats at present, one of which is that changes applied to an avatar are applied to all meshes attached to the avatar; this is fine where clothing is concerned; but as Karl points out, if you have something like a gun attached to your avatar, you don’t want it to resize as well; so he suggests boolean function may be required to determine which meshes are affected by the deformer – and this may additionally require input from Linden Lab.

Karl openly encourages LL and TPVs to incorporate the code in order to allow users such as clothing designers to experiment with it, as feedback is now the key.

Those wishing to add the code as it stands – and bearing in mind Karl’s warning that this is only an Alpha release can also find it on his website.

A JIRA (SH-1716) has been opened to deal with the deformer code itself, on which a number of baseline questions on the deformer are asked and answered by Karl himself (to reference frame for the project), and within which further questions and feedback is encouraged. Karl specifically asks that you use this JIRA, and not his website for feedback – and as an extension to this, it is suggested that the original parametric deformer JIRA is not used for feedback relating to the code.

SH-1716 already has interesting discussion-points within it, relating to preferred models on which to base the deformer, how to address the question of a boolean function to handle “rigid” attachments (such as the aforementioned gun) – and indeed whether any boolean is in fact required, or whether the matter can be handled via other means. Therefore anyone with a technical interest in the project would do well to give the JIRA a look, bearing in mind Oz’s pleas on the subject of wider discussion (although given the complexity of the subject, one would think that forcing a split in questions & feedback & wider issues could result in something of a fracturing of information on project).

Niran’s Viewer

Those really keen to see the deformer in action might want to download version 1.03 of Niran’s Viewer, which already incorporates the code, but note that NiranV regards this as an experimental release, and the code will likely be removed from the next release.

Parametric deformer: Linden Lab formally engages

Posted on by Inara Pey

It’s taken a little while – understandably, as wheels have to be set properly in motion – but the parametric deformer project has its first official update today, in which Max Graf gives an overview of what is happening:

“Karl [Qarl Fizz, aka Qarl Linden as was] has begun working on the code and was contacted by LL in order to facilitate development of this feature. He will be working directly with LL from this point forward to supply them with code as the project moves forward, allowing them to check the feature with compatibility for the official LL releases as he progresses so that when it is done it can quickly and easily be included without weekes of additional testing. They contacted him directly to expedite the process and work together from the start of this, which means it will be working correctly and will make it a lot easier for TPVs and other grids to implement once it is done!

“This is great news and in addition to the comment Charlar made about further development with open source features is indicative of some serious new possibilities for development. Kudos to LL and Karl for being able to come to the table together for the good of the SL community. This is a best case scenario for this project, and indicates a strong willingness on LL’s part to adopt and implement this new feature that we have wanted since July.”

Kudos indeed to Linden Lab!

As Max says, this is a best case scenario for the project, and will do much to ensure the completed deformer can be smoothly integrated into the Snowstorm code. This is turn should make the code easily more adaptable by those TPV developers who maintain V3.x-based Viewers, although older V1.x Viewer developers may still have a little work on their hands. Once again this is a win-win-win scenario for all: Second Life, Linden Lab and OpenSim (which faces similar issues when it comes to mesh clothing).

Estimates put the work of code development at around four weeks or so; given that LL are now going to help ensure the code can be integrated into the Viewer code more readily, the development cycle may well stretch a little – but the end result will be more than worth it.

It’s great to see the Lab respond so positively and openly with a user-based project in this way, and again demonstrates that the Lab is willing to engage and work cooperatively with the community as a whole.

It’ll be interesting to see whether this project yet proves to be a new building block in the way the Viewer is developed and enhanced in the future.

Mesh clothes: a way forward?

Posted on by Inara Pey

Mesh is here, as we know, and not entirely without problems. I, and many others, have commented on the fact that is it not easy to adjust mesh clothing to sizes that ideally fit individual avatars. Maxwell Graf was well aware of this problem, and put forward a solution via JIRA SH-2374 back in July, proposing the use of a parametric deformer.

Downgraded

As I reported on the 27th of last month, the JIRA was downgraded in status to Someday / Maybe – which came as a blow to a lot of people.

To be sure, Max’s solution was by no means easy in terms of coding – as he has always been the first to admit – the algorithms required to make the system work as presented would require considerable changes within the Viewer itself; and this clearly involves a cost element. As the current take-up of Mesh within SL is relatively low right now, that cost element, it would seem, is something the LL find hard to justify at this point in time, given what else they can potentially achieve elsewhere for effectively the same cost.

Nor, if I’m to be totally honest, did LL ever commit to making mesh suitable for all market opportunities – something I commented upon way back. Nevertheless, the fashion market in Sl is big, and LL cannot be unaware of this fact (they did host Fashion Expert Days last month) – so one might have thought they’d be aware of pressure to provide a means of clothing resizing for the advent of mesh – or at least to be prepared to be honest on the limitations.

In this regard, it has to be said that Linden Lab didn’t help themselves in the matter at all. Even after the initial roll-out,Linden staff were talking – albeit cautiously – about the limitations of mesh as a clothing medium and about Maxwell Graf’s idea  – and the appearance was that things were being earnestly looked at. Then the JIRA was downgraded without any commentary whatsoever from the Lab, leading to upset and consternation – a situation that was the same right up until yesterday, when Charlar finally commented on the JIRA thus:

“Hi everybody,

“First, because we’ve wrapped the Mesh release 2 project, we’re moving items into other backlogs. We don’t have any subsequent dedicated mesh project planned so all remaining items, including this one, will end up on our general viewer or the server backlogs.

“This does not mean anything as extreme as some residents have assumed. The fact that the backlog is called “someday/maybe” means that it’s something we want to do, but can’t commit to a timeframe yet.

“We did some investigation into the problem that Maxwell’s solution attempts to solve. We’re doing some more research and prototyping, trying to find a solution that might be faster/easier to implement. We have Top People on it…

“…I can’t promise anything – we might come back and say ‘no’, we might say ‘yes, but later’ and we might say ‘here’s what we doing’. We might say something i haven’t thought of yet.”

It’s not the most positive of statements, but at least it demonstrates that this issue is possibly not a dead horse. Why then, couldn’t the message be communicated earlier? Even a simple, “This is the situation, we’re thinking it through and will get back to you one way or another”, would have been preferable to what appeared to be an attempt to simply ignore the JIRA before quietly moving it to an inert status.

(On a wider front, I’m looking at Charlar’s comment as meaning the “non-trivial” Mesh update he mentioned at SLCC 2011 is now going to be delayed  / scrapped given he states: “We don’t have any subsequent dedicated mesh project planned“.)

Alternative

However, it now seems that matters are moving on through other means. When Hamlet Au reported on the downgrade on the 30th September, Karl Stiefvater, formerly known as Qarl Linden, dropped a comment into the feedback that at first appeared a little tongue-in-cheek:

“Anyone wanna fund an ex-linden to do it?”

Maxwell Graf, unsurprisingly, given his involvement in the issue, has taken Karl up on this offer. As reported in PrimPerfect today, Max has set up a project to enable Karl to develop an alternative solution for the issue of resizing mesh clothing in SL. Max explains it thus:

“I have established a fund on the website http://www.indiegogo.com [a leading international funding platform] for this project. You can go there and read about the project and use the secure transaction methods to contribute to hiring Karl to do this project. Our goal is US$5400.00, $5000 of which will go to Karl, and $400 of which will be used to pay for the project and website fees. No amount of donated funds will be for my personal profit or use.

“The direct link to the project fund site is here: http://www.indiegogo.com/Mesh-Clothing-Parametric-Deformer-Project

“There is no fixed amount for donations – contribute what you can. That’s the beauty of a project like this. Small amounts add up!”

The project has 61 days in which to raise the $5400 in order for it to happen. This is a not inconceivable amount, although the question will inevitably be asked “What will it give us?” Max doesn’t shirk on the answer:

“To be clear, this will not solve every problem with mesh clothing. It will not create a layered hierarchy system of deformers as mentioned in the JIRA. Once the work is done, mesh clothing will not suddenly work perfectly for you, or work in the official LL viewers (unless they put the code in).”

What the project will potentially give is:

  • A working version of a single mesh deformer in the Snowstorm open source client
  • The ability for mesh clothing items to adjust automatically to fit an avatar’s size and shape without the need to use alpha layers to hide body parts
  • Less complexity of sizing considerations for clothing designers (no alpha maps, rigged adjustment, multiple sizes, etc.).

The finished code, presented as a part of the Snowstorm project, will be available to any third-party Viewer developer / team wishing to adopt it – and will obviously be available for Linden Lab, should they fail to define  / agree upon their own alternative to the original deformer suggested by Max.

Karl, as Qarl, is no stranger to mesh in SL – he developed much of the original code prior to departing Linden Lab, and he was responsible for the sculpted prim. As such, he is ideally suited to developing the code in question.

Not Ideal

This is not an ideal solution – again as Max clearly states. It doesn’t solve problems relating to modifying mesh clothing, etc. It does, however, overcome the immediate issue of fitting mesh clothing by default and it does – and pointed out above – reduce the overall complexity of mesh product creation for clothing makers.And at this point in time, many are of the opinion that something is far more preferable to the “nothing” Linden Lab may yet opt for.

Even so, there are questions that will be asked about the project as it stands – perhaps the biggest being, “What if Linden Lab do in fact come back with a solution of their own in Charlar’s promised two week(ish) time frame?” Will this project press ahead? Will it be cancelled? What of the money raised to date if that happens?

Clearly part of the answer to all of these questions will depend on precisely how effective any alternative presented by Linden Lab is, and the timeframe they assign for its implementation. As such, it is possible that some who might otherwise fund this project may await further feedback from Linden Lab, through Charlar or otherwise – and given the overall funding timeframe for the project, this shouldn’t impact it that badly.

However, given LL’s reticence to address this issue – or even (until yesterday) give direct feedback on concerns – one cannot fault Max or those following his lead for taking this route. Indeed, one could say kudos is due here for taking this particular bull by the horns.

Note: at the time of writing, $705 had been raised for the project. This represents some 13% of the total raised in just 9 hours.

Updates

  • 6th October, 13:30 BST: the project total stands at $2,150 – almost 40% of the required $5,400, raised within 24 hours
  • 7th October, 23:00 BST: the project total stands at $2,728 – just over 50% of the required total, raised in 48 hours
  • 8th October, 23:00 BST: the project total has passed through the $3K barrier
  • 19th October, 19:30 BST: the project stands at $3,787, just over 70% of the required total
  • 20th October, 23:55 BST: the project has broekn through the $4,000 barrier in just 15 days with a total of $4,223, just over 78% of the required total

Linden Lab says “someday / maybe” to mesh parametric deformer

Posted on by Inara Pey

Linden Lab has gone to a lot of effort to provide mesh. Some of it perhaps hasn’t been handled too well at times (given the problems around Prim Equivalency, the weakness of the uploader, etc., would it really have hurt to delay the launch by a month so that some of these issues could be address as they are being already in the latest Mesh Project Viewer?).

One of the biggest issues around mesh is clothing. Simply put, the way mesh works means that options to resize worn items are limited. In some cases very limited. Even with alpha layers, it can be a case of modifying your shape to fit the item – and there are times when alpha layers aren’t suitable…leading to more and bigger issues.

Maxwell Graf suggested a means of handling the problem – a parametric deformer. He’s blogged about the idea – so have many others. He’s raised a JIRA on the subject and received the support of just about every mesh clothing designer in SL. It’s generated a lot of discussion.

It appears to have been universally ignored by Linden Lab.

Charlar Linden has commented elsewhere on the subject and suggested there might be alternative methods to employ, etc., but the lack of open commentary is confusing.

And now the JIRA has been downgraded to someday / maybe – a stance that doesn’t sound too hopeful.

Theories have been put forward as to why the JIRA has been downgraded – some have cited the recent code breakages for attachments and PRIM_PHYSICS – the suggestion that these and other issues have higher priorities, et. But such explanations really don’t make sense: this issues are under the control of a different team at LL.

Are the Lab generating an alternative? Do they simply think this is a non-issue? It’s impossible to say.

Only one this is clear right now – the stubborn silence evidenced from linden Lab isn’t winning them any favours. We’ve long been promised better and more informed communications (wasn’t that, after all what all the hoo-ha with the Lithium “Community Communications Platform”?) Rod Humble himself has promised (via Twitter) that the silence would end some time back – yet the fact remains that outward communications from Linden Lab are sporadic and frequently noteworthy for telling us what we’ve already discovered for ourselves.

Of course, one doesn’t expect LL to inform users of absolutely everything that is going on – but given the ballyhoo around mesh, the concern over limitations on mesh clothing / body attachments (which otherwise have the potential to be a huge market in-world), it would really help matters if someone, somewhere inside Battery Street actually stood up and said something on the matter of what on Earth is going on.

Rodvik? Over to you.

In the meantime, if you are cuious about mesh clothing – limitations and all – I recommend a read of Couldbe Yue’s excellent overview and guide.

Mesh: the roll-out

Posted on by Inara Pey

[POSTED 8:22PM PDT Aug 22, 2011] Rolling restarts for regions on the main Second Life server channel will be performed on Tuesday, August 23rd at approximately 5:00am PDT. Please make sure to save all builds and refrain from making purchases during this time.

Mesh: transformative? (w/thanks for Claudia222 Jewell)

With this simple notice, mesh commenced its roll-out to the remaining portion of the Main gird that has yet to see it (approximately 70%), as per the server release notes.So, assuming all goes well, the entire Main grid will be mesh enabled from today.

This isn’t the end of the mesh project, but really the beginning; thing’s are going to suddenly change overnight – it’s going to take time for mesh to make its presence felt, and as Linden Lab themselves admit, there will be further updates, revisions and improvements ahead.

As a result of this, we can doubtless expect the Beta “Viewer 3” to go to full release status shortly (if not today as well), which brings with it mesh support with some added features. Please see the update at the end of this article.

For those wishing to see mesh, issues still remain: the code for rendering mesh objects has yet to be incorporated into a number of third-party 2.x Viewers, and it unclear as to whether the code can be backported into the 1.x code.

In the meantime – a video from rockerfaerie featuring some of Claudia222 Jewell’s remarkable mesh art.

Updates

At 1300 SLT Nyx Linden confirmed the following:

  • All channels of the Main grid now support mesh except the BlueSteel RC channel (which one assumes will get mesh during the RC channel restarts on Wednesday 24th August)
  • The Default official Viewer is now Viewer 3 (currently 3.0.0.238864)

More on Mesh

Update 25th August

The “additional feature” referred to in this article was the ability to disable mesh rendering in a region. However, in commenting on a JIRA raised in relation to the capability, Charlar Linden stated:

Charlar Linden updated SH-2341:Status: Expected Behavior  (was: Open)   Resolution: Not Applicable – thanks – this flag would have no effect, and is being removed soon.

So it would appear the option to disable mesh is not intended to be a part of the Viewer.

Mesh/Live Volunteer programme ends

Posted on by Inara Pey

Linden Lab has closed the Mesh/Live Volunteer programme and applications from private full sim owners to join the programme will no longer be accepted.

This can be taken as a further sign that the mesh roll-out is progressing, and according to Charlie Linden some 30% of the Main grid is now mesh-enabled, including both the Magnum and Le Tigre Release Candidate channels (Le Tigre was prepped for mesh last week, and the initial mesh project roll-out occurred on the 10th August).

The public mesh sandbox region (SLurl) is still available for use, which includes two adult-rated sims as well as the G-rated sims.

For those wishing to se mesh on the Main grid, or have a play, the “Viewer 3.0.0″ Beta candidate with mesh support can be downloaded here.

With thanks to Opensource Obscure